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Each week, Benjamin Law asks public figures to discuss the subjects we’re told to keep private by getting them to roll a die. The numbers they land on are the topics they’re given. This week, he talks to Shane Gould. The Olympic gold medallist, 69, is the only person to hold every world freestyle record from 100m to 1500m simultaneously. She was Australian of the Year in 1972 and was awarded an AM in 2018.
SEX
You trained hard and grew up in the spotlight as a champion teen swimmer. How did all of that affect your capacity for crushes and romance? Well, actually, there were huge opportunities to be in relationships and develop socially. The great thing was that we were always semi-naked in our swimsuits, so there would be “accidental” touches, brushes against a package. I only had sisters, so … [Laughs]
What kind of guy were you attracted to growing up? When I was young, there was a boy at school who was tanned with blond hair. Strong, athletic, not super-big, nicely proportioned. He was beautiful, my physical ideal.
What kind of guy are you attracted to now? It’s the mind that attracts me now: thoughts and thoughtfulness.
Is that what you find in your husband? [Gould married swimming coach Milton Nelms in 2007.] Definitely. We had a talk just now, actually, over coffee about the sentience of animals; he’s a vegetarian. We have differences of opinion, but we can talk and go deep.
What do you envy about younger generations when it comes to sex? They’ve got more information about consent, better access to contraception and it’s not considered dirty to talk about pleasure and feelings.
What do you not envy about younger generations when it comes to sex? Just hooking up for a short time: the honeymoon phase is over after three months. There’s no maturing into a long-term relationship, which may not be explosive but is deeper.
You’re 69 years old right now. Do you feel sexy at this age? I don’t like looking in the mirror, but I have started wearing colour. A taxi driver in Melbourne once said to me, “I hate winter in Melbourne because all the women wear black and grey!” So I thought, “OK, well, there’s a good tip.” So colour helps me to feel sexy. Also, I think I’ve got nice hands … [shows hands].
You do have shockingly youthful-looking hands. I’ve been looking after my skin a lot more. I also feel sexy when I feel my muscles working. I’ve been doing yoga for about six months now: that’s making me feel a lot more relaxed, calm and in touch with my body in a different way.
Sex in your 60s. What should I expect? The reality is, things aren’t as stretchy and flexible. You’ll need more lubrication … But desire can still be as urgent and, if you’re with your long-term mate, you’ve worked out how to be attractive to each other and what turns each other on. It just takes more time and thoughtfulness.
DEATH
How has death impacted you? Losing animals is good preparation. When I was 17, a horse I loved had to be put down. That grief is very real.
What human losses have you felt the most? My mother dying in 2013 at 84. But she had sorted out her life, so even in her old age and her dying years, she was teaching us girls how to die and be prepared for death. She chose the music for her funeral and even organised all her photo albums.
You’re 70 in November: is death on your mind more? Definitely. I’m reviewing my will at the moment as well as enduring power of attorney.
Is this a confronting process for you? It is. All these questions have come up. So I need to go for a swim or a walk on the beach and think about things: really meditate and process.
What do you think happens after we die? I don’t really worry too much about what happens in the afterlife. I’m more interested in what happens here and now.
RELIGION
Tell me about your faith. When I had an evangelical sort of rebirth – at about 17 or 18 – I was involved with people who prioritised social and environmental justice. So that has sustained me: an approach to Christianity where you practise not just a personal faith, to feel good spiritually, but to actually do good works. My Christianity is a very practical thing: it’s about being an activist, environmental and social.
Would you describe yourself as religious? Well, there’s religion and there’s faith. I want to make that distinction. I have a faith; I’m not religious.
Tell me about the distinction for you. Religion is a structured, bureaucratic hierarchy. People in the church have done terrible things – war and invasions – in the name of God, and I deplore that. But there are people inspired by faith. There’s this idea of the “leap of faith” from Søren Kierkegaard, the 19th-century Danish philosopher: that faith transcends reason, logic and rational evidence. You actively commit to the unprovable.
And in what do you have faith? That I’m loved. And that whatever comes my way, I’ll be given the capacity to deal with it. I might be distraught and frustrated, but it will be OK.
Of the seven deadly sins – pride, greed, wrath, envy, lust, gluttony and sloth – to which one are you most susceptible? Pride.
But you’ve got a lot to be proud of! [Smiles] I do.
Shane Gould is a contestant on The Traitors, airing from August 4 at 7.30pm on 10 and 10 Streaming.
diceytopics@goodweekend.com.au
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